] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 1, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] Hi everyone! Well, for the first time in the history of the Ozzy Digest, there was no Digest for TWO DAYS IN A ROW! I apologize to everyone, but I have had a very hectic weekend which has included shopping for a new computer! Yes folks, after 12 YEARS of virtually uninterrupted loyalty to Commodore/Amiga, I have finally caved in and am going to get a Pentium/Windows based system! Forgive me Amiga loyalists but I'm tired of waiting until the Magic Belt's next 1,000-miracle tune-up for Amiga to catch up to the age of Ozma! FWIW, I fear the only thing that can save Amiga now is a buy-up by Smith and Tinker's. Anyway, I apologize for the delays, and the Digest will now return to its regularly scheduled programming... :) ONLY 18 MORE DAYS UNTIL THE SOUTH WINKIE CONVENTION! -- Dave ============================================================================= Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 07:59:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 09-27-96 > From: Nathan DeHoff > Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 09-26-96 > > David and Eric: > What was the Oogaboo-related contradiction? I recently purchased both of your > books (_Glass Cat_ and _Queen Ann_), and, as far as I can remember, the only > major contradiction was that in _Queen Ann_, all of the men in Oogaboo were > named either Jo or Jol, and in _Glass Cat_, some of them had other names. By > the way, I enjoyed both of the books. WEll, first of all it's not Karyl and I who named all the men Jo (or, to use it's archaic equivalent, Jol), but Baum. (For those who don't know, "Queen Ann" is a follow-up to Baum's "Tik-Tok of Oz.") But the contradiction isn't in the published version anyway. Our original ms. for "Queen Ann" included a postscript that (***Spoiler Alert!***) showed some of the major Emerald City celebrities coming to Oogaboo in preparation for Ozma making it snow in the mountains and Jody's forest being transported to the pass. This, then, explains the endpapers of the hardback edition, if you've seen that, showing everyone playing in the snow. Our book is set in the mid-40's (Earth time), while David's is set in more contemporary times, yet in "Glass Cat" the pass is still barren and dry. But never fear, if Karyl and I EVER get around to writing that sequel to "Queen Ann," it will be about Jody Forest and her efforts to bring snow to the pass, and it can be reconciled with "Glass Cat." (***Okay, start reading again, no more spoilers.***) > Eric: > I doubt that its disagreement with GLASS CAT was the real reason that the > epilog of QUEEN ANN was cut, but it's theoretically possible - BoW had had > the MS of GLASS CAT for about 8 months before QUEEN ANN was published. And BoW had the ms. of "Queen Ann" for about two years before it was published. It was cut for space reasons, as were a few other tidbits, but despite weakening the ending a bit, I don't think any of the cuts hurt the story at all. Other than the epilog, it was mostly Winkie Convention in-jokes. I'm going to start the final FAQ upgrade this weekend, I'll let everyone know how far I get Monday. --Eric Gjovaag # Come visit my "Wizard of Oz" web site! http://www.eskimo.com/~tiktok/ # ===================================================================== Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 13:28:33 -0400 From: RMorris306@aol.com Subject: Recent Ozzy Digests Hi again! Some rare free time: Ruth Berman wrote: <> And Fred Stone's Scarecrow--who, unlike Bolger's, Thompson had actually seen when she wrote most of her books--could have done even better. Eric Gjovaag wrote: <<..you can coordinate with Karyl and me, and maybe we won't contradict each other again. (Hmm, maybe THAT'S the real reason our epilogue was cut from "Queen Ann"...)>> That's the first I've heard of it...what was your Epilogue about? It's interesting, though, that so many Oz writers (you, David, the author of the Nero Zeero story) seem to return to Oogaboo for a setting, whereas I don't remember anyone using, say, Rigmarole Town. (Hey, maybe that's a thought if I ever write an Oz book...especially if BoW pays by the word!) Nathan DeHoff wrote: <> That's right; I'm one of those who finds Thompson's occasional severe punishments (for Mombi, as well as Crunch, Mooj, Glegg and others) rather off-putting, as opposed to Baum's rather gentle disposal of most of his villains. <> Agreed! And, as we all know, RINKITINK was a special case; changed into an Oz book at the last minute. No doubt Inga himself was able to free his parents in Baum's original, non-Oz, manuscript. David Hulan wrote: <> For the most part, though, Baum tried to make his little kingdoms relevant to the plot, as in LOST PRINCESS, where in Thi the travellers learned of the background of the villain, Ugu the Shoemaker, and in Bear Center the Big Lavender Bear joined the party and played a role in the rest of the book. Thompson at her best did that, too, as in my first of her books, JACK PUMPKINHEAD, where only a few places like Chimneyville and Swing City were completely irrelvant. (The Christmas tree and Scare City might have seemed so, if they hadn't been responsible for the travellers picking up the Red Jinn's dinner bell and meeting Snif the Iffin, both of them important to the main plot.) It's hard to really pin down the ways in which Thompson tends to talk down to the reader more than Baum, and it also depends on how much tolerance one has for that sort of thing (and mine's high; how else could I enjoy the Pooh books?) The only one that really comes to mind was the claim that all candles, even in the outside world, came from Illumi Nation, clearly not the case (as opposed to Baum's having the Big Lavender Bear threaten to send a recalcitrant subject to America for a child to play with...but he never indicated that all toy bears came from Bear Center, or even that he would, or could, ever carry out such a threat). Tyler Jones wrote: <> It depends. I certainly don't think, nor do many here seem to, that OZOPLANING was one of her better books (and her late IWOCC novels, YANKEE and ENCHANTED ISLAND, were nothing to write home about, either), but on the whole her novels of the '30's did seem to be where she finally hit her stride. I liked most of her books, though the consensus is probably right that GRAMPA and COWARDLY LION weren't among her better ones (though I still liked both better than OZOPLANING). Rich Morrissey ===================================================================== Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 15:26:50 -0400 From: "Melody G. Keller" <104270.2374@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest, 09-24-96 Jane: Five manuscripts? Don't worry. In March 1997, the IWOC will likely be bombed by last-minute Oz Book Contest submissions... David: Thanks for catching me in a goof. Ozma acts the most like her Baumian self in Speedy in Oz, one of my OTHER favorite RPT's. Shall have to look at Wishing Horse again--she may be next-closest to her Baumian self in that one--what little we see of her. I'll try to find the 400-mile reference for you. Mom & Dad Save the World seems to have been a Made-for-Cable movie. You can buy or rent it at the video stores. Warning: more violence than MGM's Wizard--though the villain's villainy is probably comparable to the Nome King's--look at how he executes his general in "Emerald City." However, the Spengans WILL remind you of the silllier Oz characters. Melody Grandy ===================================================================== Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 22:25:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 09-28-96 Just read Tony Kushner's "Angels in America" for a class on 20th century American Theatre. Have any of you seen this? There are some Ozzy references in the second part of the play that could be interpreted in rather interesting ways... But I won't go into this in detail unless any of you are acquainted with the play and are interested in discussing it. Ruth Berman - I'm sure you know this, but just as a reminder, Yip Harburg's biography is actually called "who put the rainbow in the wizard of oz". Hah! In fact, I have just now gotten to the part of the digest where you write that you are now reading this biography... :-) Nathan - the animal at the end of my message is supposed to be a sleeping cat. It is not my own work, I stole it from somebody else. I used to have the artist's little copyright next to it, but that got erased, not on purpose! |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com http://www.scso.com/~gili ===================================================================== Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 19:56:24 -0600 From: khackney@hub.ofthe.net (Kenneth Hackney) Subject: Gnome King and The Forbidden Fountain >Yes, he was also dipped in the Forbidden Fountain (presumably >Thompson wrote this part hurriedly, and forgot that one had to drink the water >for it to take effect), but Ruggedo seemed to be largely immune to this water. ************************Spoiler for Emerald City of OZ************************ Guess I need to go back and reread this, but Ruggedo was called Roquat the Red until his first immersion in the Forbidden Fountain. He was held in the water, as I remember it, until he finally swallowed some. Then he forgot his name and his intentions, which were the conquest of the Emerald City. This occured at the end of The Emerald City of OZ. Before him the Whimsies, Growliewogs and Phantasms had been able to drink of the Forbidden Fountain to quinch the thirst created by marching through the dust placed in the gnomes' tunnel by the Wizard under the direction of Glinda. Roquat was thoroughly affected by the waters and was like a smiling child full of wonder at the glitter of the Emerald City. However, OZMA let the Gnome King go home, and there he relearned his wicked ways, although not his original name apparently, as he was henceforth called Ruggedo the Rough and not Roquat the Red. ************************As If You Really Needed This Warning****************** On how many occassions was the Gnome King dipped in the fountain? Two. Maybe he had some lesser effect to a second exposure. When he had already been held in the water until he drank some in an earlier book, why repeat all the detail when this is done again years later? Regards, Ken H. ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 23:16:08 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 09-28-96 Aaron: I think that only the band that kidnapped Ojo was banished from Oz. There are probably several different gypsy tribes in the country. _Enchanted Island_ mentions a group of Gypsy Giants, and it is highly doubtful that they spent any time in Europe. Besides, the gypsies mentioned by Toby Bridlecull (the highwayman in _Forbidden Fountain_), did not really live in Oz, but in the Impassable Desert. Presumably they had some sort of magic that protected them from the harmful effects of the desert sands. Regarding the illustrations: I did notice that Neill's drawings seemed to deteriorate a little over the years. They were still pretty good in the later books, but there were contradictions of the text, even in Neill's own books, if I remember correctly. -Nathan Mulac DeHoff ===================================================================== Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 06:34:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 09-28-96 Oops, forgot to mention this the other day: Saw a notice in Thursday's paper that "The Oz Kids Collection" will be released on video on Tuesday. Coincidentally, that's payday for me... My suggestion for Ken's chronologies: Serialize it. Send Dave the chronologies for two or three books a day. But I may also be able to put the whole thing on my FTP site, once I get it up and running. > From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> > Subject: Today's Growls > > Hmmm - Percy Vere the rhymer. My favorite comic strip was always Alley Oop. > Alley had a friend, Foozy, who said everything in rhyme. The strip started in > 1933. I wonder if V.T. Hamlin got the idea from RPT? Grandpa was published in > 1924. Anybody know any other rhyming characters in literature, etc.? Scraps. Just about everyone in Shakespeare. --Eric Gjovaag # Come visit my "Wizard of Oz" web site! http://www.eskimo.com/~tiktok/ # ===================================================================== Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 11:34:44 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest, 09-28-96 Nathan: I agree that I prefer Melody's chapters about the Mangaboos in DISENCHANTED PRINCESS than Baum's in DOTWIZ. But then, DISENCHANTED PRINCESS is a much better book than DOTWIZ. Ruth: It's true that we get Ozma's viewpoint very briefly in KABUMPO and JACK PUMPKINHEAD, though it's so brief that I hadn't even noticed it until you pointed it out. And even in those cases we see almost nothing of her thoughts. It could be argued that in those cases we're not really getting Ozma's viewpoint, but the omniscient author's viewpoint telling us what she wants us to know about Ozma's thoughts and feelings. Interesting speculation - as I mentioned the other day, Harburg's other best-known musical is probably FINIAN'S RAINBOW, where again the rainbow is a dominant symbol ("Look to the Rainbow" echoing "Over the Rainbow", perhaps?). Wonder if he had an impressive childhood experience with a rainbow? Danny: I know that Neill's eyesight was failing badly toward the end of his life, and that the deterioration in the detail of his drawings has been at least partially attributed to that. I don't know if that was the whole explanation for the shift in his style (and I agree that his most impressive work was done early, with ROAD my favorite collection of illustrations, though it's my least favorite Baum as a story), but it was undoubtedly part of it. Aaron: I don't think there's any reason to believe that the gypsy tribe in OJO comprised the whole gypsy population of Oz, or that Ozma banished any Ozian gypsies other than Zithero's tribe. So the gypsies referred to in FORBIDDEN FOUNTAIN never caused me any problem. Your suggestion that Glinda discovered the danger to Zithero's tribe when Hitler came to power and advised Ozma to bring them back to Oz (with their first stop being a "re-education camp"?) would also make sense. Bear: Other rhyming characters in literature, etc.? I remember "Bucky Bug", which was a standard feature in WALT DISNEY'S COMIC AND STORIES back in the Forties, where all the characters spoke in verse. And there was "Clancy, the Rhyming Cop" (at least, I think that was his name) who was a sort of comic relief strip in one of the superhero comics - I think from DC - in those days as well. (His gimmick was looking for a rhyme for a particular word throughout the story; then, when he'd capture the villain, the villain would say a word that gave him his missing rhyme.) Both of these are more "etc." than "literature", but then so is Foozy. In Oz, Scraps speaks in verse as often as not, and the Flittermouse in MERRY-GO-ROUND does as well. And everyone who rides Pigasus has to speak in verse, but you haven't gotten to the two books where he appears yet. I'm sure there are lots more, but those are ones who come to me offhand. (Of course, almost all of Shakespeare's characters speak in verse all the time, though it's usually not rhymed. ) David Hulan ====================================================================== Date-warning: Date header was inserted by delphi.com From: dsparker@mail.utexas.edu (Douglass S. Parker) Subject: Re: Volkov books Query: Has anyone an address for the publisher[s] of the Volkov Oz-types creations as given in the Ozzy Digest FAQ 2.10--"Peter Blystone and the Red Branch Press"? Or are the books long gone into OP-land? I haven't been able to run books or publishers down in normal commercial channels--Books In Print and the like. Doug Parker ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 19:55:07 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 09-28-96 "Over the Rainbow" was the name of chapter 12 in Neill's LUCKY BUCKY. I wonder if Harburg minded the use of the name; it certainly fit the chapter well enough, but I won't say how 'cause it'd be a spoiler. Neill goofs: P.40 of THE OZ GAME BOOK shows a few of Neill's errors. If I ever get around to the second game book, I'll include others. Denslow goof: p.15 of THE OZ GAME BOOK. (Too many body parts for the Tin Woodman. Actually, maybe this picture gave Baum the idea for Chopfyt...) Dirk goof: p.21 of OGB. This one, like the upside down scarecrow Ruth's already mentioned, is the publisher's fault. The illo is reversed. ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 09:04:52 -0400 (EDT) From: "Mark K. DeJohn" <103330.323@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 09-28-96 From: Barbara DeJohn Hello everyone At the local mall was the "Wizard of Oz" bus yesterday. It is sponsored by Greyhound and has a small museum with it. The museum had picture boards of the movie, several costumes (Dorothy's, two munchkin and a winkie hat), replica ruby slippers, two TV sets with films one about make-up and the other special effects and the mattel dolls. Laurel had her picture taken with the Scarecrow. I asked what their future schedule was to pass it on to you but the guy I talked to said he had the schedule at his hotel. I gave him my card but he hasn't gotten back to me yet. He did know that they are going to be in the Boston area on Friday and Sat. so you Bean Townies can look for it. They gave out Greyhound bus info with WoOZ themes and coupons for the mall but they were only good for that day. I met two women who were taking pictures, like I was who said that they were the biggest WoOZ fans. I asked them if they knew about about IWOCand they didn't so I told them to call me and I'd fill them in on it. Ozzily, Barbara 103330.323@compuserve.com ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 15:18:58 -0400 From: OzBucket@aol.com Subject: All That I am not usually interested in watching *All That* (a sketch comedy on Nickelodeon), as what I've seen of it did not appeal to my personal tastes, but I happened to catch a few minutes of it the other day. It had a very odd parody of the MGM movie called *The Wizard of Cos* A Bill Cosby imitator was the Wizard, and Dorothy met a toad-man and a man made of pasta. I'm not sure when it re-runs, but you might be interested in it, or maybe someone on the Digest would. ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 19:07:05 -0400 From: Ozisus@aol.com Subject: Maguire's Topeka appearance I've been notified that Gregory Maguire's talk and book signing at Washburn University in Topeka, Ks., has been effected by airline scheduling problems. His talk on campus will be from 7:30 to 9:00 p.m. Saturday, Oct. 19. He will sign books during this time; a scheduled book signing at the Topeka Public Library that afternoon had to be cancelled. Steve Teller , you and I be the only Digesters within driving distance. LEt me know if you are coming. I hope to attend but don't know for sure yet. Jane ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 2, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ============================================================================= Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 01:17:25 +0000 From: rri0189@ibm.net Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 09-25-96 Homer: You asked the question a few days ago, but as no one else seems to have answered.... (It's late and I've been skimming. If someone else did answer and I missed it, I apologize.) No, our own Jane Albright has not been leading a double life in TV-land. The actress *Jane* Curtin plays Dr. *Mary* Albright on "3rd Rock From the Sun." -- Eleanor Kennedy ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 02:53:03 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy DIgest Nathan: I would welcome any reviews of Buckethead books by you. A rating is not required, of course. I only ask that you either use the one in place now or use nothing. This is not to force people to think like me, but rather to give a uniform scale so that people can get a consensus among people who do rate them. If you choose not to rate books, then that does not apply. To send me a review, just write it up and mail it to me privately. While I accept negative reviews, I ask that you be obejctive in your writing. Steve: The Queen of the Faries is named Zurline in _Santa Claus_. I used to think that Lurline, Zurline and Lulea were all the same person, but I no longer do, since they appear to behave different and have different powers and responsibilities. Aaron, Steve and mythology: I have always been under the impression that mythology is a very hodgepodge collection of stories and tales, many of which contradict each other and sometimes give the same god/goddess different characteristics and manifestations. I do not know if there is an "official" greek mythology against which other stories can be checked. Danny: Your point has been noted before by people, although neve mentioned in the digest, IIRC. Neill's work started to drop off toward the end of RPT and was quite inferior to his early work. David and Nathan: Another possible explanation is that different passes were used in the books. WHile it is mentioned somewhere that there is only one pass in and out of Oogaboo, this information was probably given by the Oogaboos themselves. They rarely if ever leave their country and few visit, so it is possible that there are many passes through the mountains and people may actually use two of them while believing they used the same one! David: Bob Up stayed in Oz because he had nothing to go home to, unlike Peter and Speedy. Button-Bright apparantly had a family, and he even went back to them once, after _Road_, but for some unexplained reason, he stayed after his adventure in _Scarecrow_. Also, I got your message to my old address and you should have recieved my reply. It is strange that my old account still works. They told me that it would be killed two weeks after I started with my new address, and I have been here at least 15 days. However, it may be destroyed at any time, so please if anybody sends me private e-mail, do so at my new address. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 11:33:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-01-96 Ken: Actually, the Nome King drank water from the Forbidden Fountain on three occasions, in _Emerald City_, _Magic_, and _Gnome King_. After the first drink, it took Roquat/Ruggedo some time, as well as exposure to the Nome Kingdom, to relearn his old ways. The second time, however, the magic of the water "wore off," as Thompson states in _Kabumpo_. I only read part of _Pirates_, and I read that part only once, but I seem to remember Thompson saying that the water wore off that time, as well. Perhaps the Nome King built up an immunity to the water, or maybe he was aided by some other magic. Actually, now that I think about it, it might have been Glegg who restored Rug's memory between _Magic_ and _Kabumpo_, since the former Nome King was an important part of his plan to marry Peg Amy. Eric: Hope to see the _Queen Ann_ sequel soon! Rich: Oogaboo may have been used in modern books because it was a fairly major Oz nation. Most of the other minor Kingdoms in Baum's books (like Rigmarole Town) were only briefly visited, while Oogaboo was the home of several major characters in _Tik-Tok_. Thompson used many minor Oz Kingdoms as homes for important characters (Pumperdink, Ragbad, Kimbaloo, the Land of the Barons, Corumbia, and Keretaria are just a few examples), but the books containing these Kingdoms are still in copyright. Yes, the places visited in _Lost Princess_ were relevant to the plot, but _Lost Princess_ was quite possibly Baum's best-plotted books. Baum certainly introduced a lot of minor Oz communities that were irrelevant to the plot, such as Mist Valley, the Great Waterfall, Loonville, and pretty much every place visited in _Emerald City_. I also have tolerance for the "talking down" in Thompson's books, and I even enjoy it sometimes! -Nathan Mulac DeHoff ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 11:08:08 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-01-96 Dave: Congratulations on the new computer! (Even if it is the kind that supports Bill Gates's Evil Empire... :-) ) You do realize, of course, that I've been going through withdrawal the last couple of days! (Greatly amusing my wife as I log on every couple of hours and then whimper, "STILL no Ozzy Digest!") Eric: It's true that the forest isn't actually moved in the published version of QUEEN ANN, but Ozma says it will be, and that means it surely happened, right? Rich: I think it's fairly easy to understand why other Oz writers have returned to Oogaboo more than to other Oz sites - it's a reasonably complete, well-set-up small kingdom, and there aren't many of those in PD as yet. The little places Dorothy visits in EC (Cuttenclips, Fuddlecumjig, Utensia, Bunbury, Bunnybury, Rigmarole Town, Flutterbudget Center) are mostly so specialized that they wouldn't support much action. The Hoppers and Horners are possibilities, as are Thi and Herku (in fact, Herku is used in GLASS CAT, although it's not visited); Jinxland and the Hyup country are so isolated that they'd be difficult. I think Dave is using the Flathead/Skeezer country in LOCASTA AND THE THREE ADEPTS. In another couple of years, assuming they don't extend copyrights again, I fully expect to see Pumperdink reappearing in new books. (And BoW doesn't pay by the word, I can assure you...) Thi is totally irrelevant to the plot of LOST PRINCESS; the travelers found out about Ugu in Herku. Thi was nothing but padding, like the Winkie who couldn't understand the speech of animals and the Merry-go-round Mountains. (Fun padding, but IEs for sure.) The same could be said for the Loons and the Hip-po-gy-raf in TIN WOODMAN, and the giant spiders and the mist valley in GLINDA. And, of course, the whole plot of DOTWIZ after the arrival of the Wizard in the Mangaboo Country was really an IE, since by 4:00 PM that day Dorothy could have made the sign, had Ozma bring them all to Oz, and then send home those who wanted to go back to America. I think just about everyone agrees that OZOPLANING is one of Thompson's worst books, but one also has to recognize that she was feuding with R&L by the time she wrote it, and probably wasn't trying very hard. The rest of her books steadily get better starting around GNOME KING and continuing up through OJO, after which she was at a plateau of quite high quality that continued until the anomalous case of OZOPLANING. (Before GNOME KING she was erratic; there were some good books and some rather poor ones, though opinions differ a good deal on which were which.) Ken H.: ************Spoilers for EMERALD CITY and MAGIC************* Actually, the Nome King was only Roquat the Red in EC; in OZMA he was Roquat of the Rocks. And Ozma placed the dust in the tunnel at the Scarecrow's advice; neither Glinda nor the Wizard were involved. And while Ruggedo wasn't dipped in the Fountain of Oblivion in MAGIC, he did drink of its water then and once again forgot his past. *************End spoilers******************************** Steve: Off topic, but I saw in the sports section of the TRIB the other day that your school had just set a new NCAA record for consecutive football wins. Congratulations! David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 13:18:34 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-01-96 ENCHANTED ISLAND was written quite a long time ago. Ruth polished it up at the request of the Oz Club, and added Oz elements to it. Like Baum's RINKITINK, it hadn't been planned as an Oz book. YANKEE went to press with essentially no editing, just proofing. That may be why they feel so different from her other books. Neill's illos also changed with the simpler line drawing styles of more modern times. Early in the Oz series, he's still busy imitating Denslow's poster style, but by ROAD, he's ready to do his own thing...to the point of ridiculing Denslow in the illo of Dorothy tittering and Toto cracking up at his versions of them. Like Ruth Berman, I think the finest of his work--certainly the richest, most involved, detailed, and beautifully convoluted--is in ROAD for his Oz drawings, but his work in PETER AND THE PRINCESS is utterly gorgeous--delicate and romantic...well worth hunting. I'll try to remember to check for the author's name when I get home; I'm at school now. Then some of you DIGESTERS may get a chance to see it, too. CHRIS: Good to see you back in the DIGEST. I was beginning to worry about you! --Robin ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 14:38:04 -0700 From: "Stephen J. Teller" Subject: OZMA, Reggedo et al. ***SPOILER FOR LOST KING *** IMHO the low point of Ozma's career is in the book LOST KING. Here she becomes dithering and almost incompetant. When she meets Pastoria she is ready to abdicate in his favor. When the question of what to do with Mombi arises, she lets Dorothy decide for her, permitting her foster mother to be destroyed summarily, in contrast to the way she treated enemies in LFB's books. ***END OF SPOILER****** Roquat's name change: This is a case where theatrical matters impugned of literary ones. In LFB's third Ozian Musical THE TIK-TOK MAN OF OZ (which was largely based on OZMA OF OZ) he called the king Ruggedo, so when this was transformed into a book the name was retained, and a footnote was inserted to justify the change. Neill's Art: It is true that Neill's work greatly simplified over the years, but this may partly due to a change in tastes. Even in his earliest illustrations he was not always faithful to his text. In OZMA Langwidaire's hair (on the head she was wearing at the time) is described as being black, but in the pictures it is platinum blonde. In the illustration in which the Scarecrow throws the egg at the Nome King, the Tin Woodman is visible in the background although he was a Tin Whistle at the time. Maguire lecture: I do not know if I will try to attend the Maguire lecture in Topeka. It is about a 3 hour drive each way, and six hours on the road is a lot of driving to hear the author of WICKED. Now if LFB were speaking I would not hesitate, but that is unlikely. Steve T. ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 21:06:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Today's Growls Dave - Glad you have solved your hardware problem. I can tell you you had some of us worried. The last Digest like this vanished in cyberspace without a whisper. Eric - you have let slip you have a job - the "payday" reference. So is it in teaching or are you designing WWW pages for a living? Eric/David - Rhyming characters. Another I remember is "the Rhyming Rabbit" from one of the all time great radio shows, "Judy and Jimmy and The Cinnamon Bear." Friends, if you like Oz books you'll love this! Easily available from many sources now. I had to fight Inkaboos, avoid the Wintergreen Witch and wrestle the Crazy Quilt Dragon to get my original copy. Regards, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Wednesday 02-Oct-96 12:10:12 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things RUG AND THE H2O OF OB.: MOPPeT (presented in _Locasta_) is that between _Magic_ and _Kabumpo_, Ruggedo magically not only regained his memory, but also aquired an immunity to the Water of Ob. for ever after. (I'm NOT at liberty to reveal what that magic was, however...) OZMA ESSAY: David Hulan's essay on Ozma's rule is now in my Ozzy file archive and anyone may request it. I have finally gotten around to reading it and it is a good essay. David shares my view that Ozma's abduction in _Lost Princess_ motivated her to garner much more wisdom and other leadership qualities, as well as much more magical powers. The only addtional thing in my MOPPeT about Ozma is that Thompson (or maybe her informants) disliked Ozma's new strong-mindedness and so painted Ozma in the worst possible light (thus her *apparently* sordid behavior in _Lost King_ and elsewhere). NEW DIGEST POLICY: Well, not actually a new *policy*. but I'm going to ask a big favor of everyone...Could you all please make a point of putting the letters "Oz" somewhere in the Subject: line of your Digest submissions? This would make it much easier for me to isolate the Digest messages from the mass of other mail I receive each day, and more quickly incorporate them in the Digest. Most people have "Oz" in their subjects already, saying either "Oz", or "Ozzy Digest" or replying to the Digest directly, so their mailers automatically make the subject, "RE: Ozzy Digest". These people need do nothing different in future, but for those who regularly have subject lines that don't include the string "Oz", I'm asking them, as a favor to me, to do so in future, even it is as a "header", e.g. "Oz: Today's Growls". I will NOT exclude your message if it lacks "Oz", that would be unfair of me, but just advising everyone on how they can make my life a little easier. :) -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 3, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ============================================================================= Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 00:48:56 -0400 From: RMorris306@aol.com Subject: Recent Ozzy Digests Tyler Jones wrote: <> He ignored them, but for the most part seemed to try to be consistent with them (and I can't really fault him for changing the Soldier with the Green Whiskers back to Omby Amby rather than Wantowin Battles...nor for presenting an Oz free of Scalawagons and without the Scarecrow (inexplicably) as King of the Munchkins). He certainly included all the writers in WHO'S WHO IN OZ, except the then-unpublished MERRY GO ROUND. Bear wrote: <> It's magic, not science. How is that different from the Silver Shoes taking Dorothy home (in WIZARD) in three steps? Kenneth Hackney wrote: <> Or, as his name was given on his first appearance in OZMA, Roquat of the Rocks. <> As several of us here have theorized, nomes in general may have the ability to shake off the effects, not to mention building up an immunity. The Oz people suspect his own subjects "taught him to be as wicked as he was before," but I suspect he just got his memory and personality back. True, he changed his name (no doubt because Baum had used the name of Ruggedo for the character in his musical), but I never quite bought that he'd forgotten the name Roquat...Ozma TOLD it to him after his amnesia in EMERALD CITY. I suspect he never liked his original name, and jumped at the excuse to change it. In any case, he drank from the fountain again in MAGIC, but had his memory back within three years in KABUMPO...and seemed to regain it almost immediately after GNOME KING, if he'd even lost it at all. By that time, I suspect, he'd become completely immune to it. David Hulan wrote: <> Actually, you're combining two DC features. Henry Boltinoff, brother of DC editor Murray Boltinoff and a well-known magazine cartoonist, did a number of one-page features for the company, with regular characters ranging from a typical boy and girl (Little Pete and Bebe) to more exotic characters including Super-Turtle, Moolah the Mystic, and Tricksy the World's Greatest Stunt Man. One of them was Clancy the Cop--who, especially in later years, was more often Casey the Cop. But I think the character you're thinking of was Hayfoot Henry, a 5-page (later dropped to 4-page) backup in ACTION COMICS, the DC comic book that led off with Superman (and still does) during the middle 1940's. Henry (Henry Wadsworth Shortfellow) was writing a rhyming dictionary, but he and everyone else in the strip talked in rhyme, with the entire script being written as a poem (including captions and sound effects). As it happens, the strip was written by a friend of mine, Alvin Schwartz, who also wrote a number of stories featuring Superman and Batman (especially for the two heroes' newspaper strips) in the '40's and '50's, including the first appearances of the Superman-Batman team, red kryptonite, and probably Bizarro (none of which he considered terribly good ideas--Bizarro was created by either Schwartz or Otto Binder, depending on whether the newspaper strip or comic book appearance of the character was prepared first). Henry could find a rhyme for anything, though occasionally people with specific accents helped a bit...like a cowboy who managed to rhyme "applesauce" with his "dapple hoss," or a Cockney who found a match for the notorious "orange" with his door 'inge... Time I got back to Oz, isn't it? I agree that GNOME KING, JACK PUMPKINHEAD, and PIRATES are a series, since all feature Peter--but I wouldn't add CAPTAIN SALT to the list, since Peter's not in it. (True, the main characters were introduced in PIRATES, but by that reasoning one could also add PURPLE PRINCE and SILVER PRINCESS, which pick up on characters introduced in JACK PUMPKINHEAD (as well as KABUMPO). And, though I think I've mentioned this before, Thompson had the same problem with Peter that Baum had with Dorothy...he didn't age as much as he should have, while living outside Oz. Peter was 9 in GNOME KING, and 11 two years later in JACK PUMPKINHEAD...so far, so good. But three years later in PIRATES, he was STILL only 11! Did Thompson fudge that for better reader identification? If so, it was rather clumsy, since she specifically stated five years had gone by since GNOME KING! Yet, having learned what I have about Reilly & Lee editors, I suspect Thompson's manuscript actually DID make Peter 14 (Neill draws him about that old...and also wearing a Boy Scout uniform, and at the time Boy Scouts had to be at least 12), and the editor changed him (as s/he did to Jenny Jump later??!!) not realizing how confused that made everything! Rich Morrissey ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 06:48:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Ozzy Stuff (for da Digest) Someone asked me, "What's the 'Oz Kids Collection'?" Since there may be others wondering, I'll let everyone know here. "The Oz Kids" is a cartoon series produced over the last couple of years by Hyperion Animation, who made "The Brave Little Toaster." The head (forgot his name) is a life-long Oz fan. The series has already been shown abroad (Gili's seen it in Israel, right?), but no American distributor has been found yet, so while they keep looking they're releasing them on video. The stories are based on Baum stories (and not just Oz ones, either), but the characters are the children of all of our old friends. I've seen some of it at Winkies, and it looks like fun. There was an article in the "Seattle Times" last night about Dorothy Gage, the Baum's niece who died in infancy and probably inspired Baum's most famous character. Sally Roesch Wagner, the historian who first made the connection between the two Dorothy's (she wrote the "Bugle" article about it a few years ago) found Dorothy Gage's grave in Bloomington, Illinois. Well, it may take a LOT longer than I thought to get the FAQ on my web site updated, since Laura's been installing Windows 95 on her computer this week, and it's taking longer than she anticipated to get everything up and running smoothly. So, for those of you wondering about the answer to the salary question, sorry, it's going to be a while before you can see for yourself. --Eric Gjovaag # Come visit my "Wizard of Oz" web site! http://www.eskimo.com/~tiktok/ # ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 16:10:58 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-02-96 Help! A teacher friend of mine wants to know the difference between a myth, a folk tale, a fairy tale, and a fable. The fable part isn't too hard, but I don't really know how to answer her. Myth, I guess, deals with "higher powers" and "why is this so?" stuff, but folk tales do that too. Anyone able to clarify? A standard dictionary definition doesn't really do it here, I'm afraid. Tolkien's essay isn't particularly helpful either, IIRC, but I may be wrong. ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 16:13:42 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-02-96 PETER AND THE PRINCESS was written by Carl H. Grabo. ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 14:44:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Peter Hanff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-02-96 Dave, I'm sorry to report the death of longtime Oz Club member, Gary Kendall. Gary attended the Ozmopolitan meeting in June and enjoyed himself despite the ravages of his wasting illness. I spoke with him by telephone about a month ago and he remained characteristically upbeat and forward looking, although he admitted to being increasingly exhausted. He was a quiet, somewhat shy member of the Oz Club, but those of us who had the privilege of knowing him will long remember his humor, his keen love of things Ozian, and his devotion to his friends, and to his beloved Yugoslavia. Peter ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 18:11:16 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-02-96 Tyler: Strictly speaking, Zurline is Queen of the Wood Nymphs in SANTA CLAUS; since a Queen of the Fairies is also mentioned (though not named) in that book, it's pretty unlikely that they're the same. (But I suspect Baum was thinking of Zurline when he named the character Lurline in TIN WOODMAN - probably without checking back to the earlier book. He doesn't seem to have made a habit of that.) I think Hesiod is considered more or less "official" Greek mythology as far as he goes, but there are a great many Greek myths from other sources that are also found in compendia like Bulfinch's MYTHOLOGY. There's certainly nothing like the Bible or the Koran that the Greeks believed to have divine inspiration such that anything not in it was of far lesser authority. (This is why the Greeks picked up all sorts of mythological stories from other sources; Adonis, for instance, is based on Semitic fertility gods and the name is from the same root as "Adonai" in Hebrew.) ***************MILD SPOILER FOR GLASS CAT*********************** It's possible that there are multiple passes through the mountains surrounding Oogaboo, but if so, then it would make my having the Bad Lads post guards at the entrance to "the pass" rather pointless. It's pretty clear in GC, if not in QA, that the Oogaboos know of only one pass out of their valley, and they'd surely know of the pass that contained Jodie's forest, so those two passes must be the same, even if there are others. I prefer to think that the forest didn't thrive in the pass (rocky soil isn't really very good for trees), and it was moved sometime during the 40-odd years between the books to a better location. (It may be the forest where Salye was captured, for instance.) ***************END SPOILER************************************* It's true that Peter and Speedy had something to return to in America, where Bob Up didn't, but I know that even when I was a kid I wouldn't have hesitated a New York minute if I'd been offered the chance to stay in Oz, even though I had a loving family to return to. I'd have done my best to get a message to them telling them I was OK so they wouldn't worry, but in a crunch I'd have stayed anyway. (It would be even more true at my current age, where the thought of not aging any further would be irresistible. With a kid like Peter or Speedy that would be much less of a consideration, of course.) But it's true that Thompson would probably have had a harder time selling that. After Trot and Button-Bright, the only children who stayed in Oz in the FF were orphans. (Of course, Peter and Speedy were technically orphans, but they did live with blood relatives.) Well, I take that back. Bucky Jones may or may not have had blood relatives left in America; we don't really know. He had an uncle who owned the tug that exploded and blew him to the Nonestic/Nonentic, but if that uncle was on the tug he might not have been as lucky as Lucky Bucky. And that might have been his only remaining relative. We know Bob Up, Jenny Jump, and Robin Brown were all alone in the world. Nathan: See my last post; even in LOST PRINCESS Baum included some IEs, though fewer than in most of his books. As far as the places in EC are concerned, I think that Cuttenclips, Fuddlecumjigs, Rigmarole Town, and Flutterbudget Center aren't really irrelevant to the plot (such as it is), since the travelers intended to visit those places when they left the EC. Utensia, Bunbury, and Bunnybury, however, along with the zebra and the crab and the careless kangaroo, are IEs, since they are entirely unnecessary to the plot (although Utensia and Bunnybury are more fun than the places they intended to go in the first place). Steve: ****************SPOILER FOR LOST KING************************ I agree with you that LOST KING probably shows Ozma at her worst, but I suspect that suddenly finding out that a father that you'd thought was long-since dead is alive would throw most people into a tizzy for a little while, and the whole period of time from Ozma's first appearance to the end of the book is a matter of a few hours. (Ozma has a footman clear away her breakfast dishes just before the feather arrives instructing them to go to Morrow. They arrive back in the palace and do quite a lot of things before finishing by eating dinner that same day. I'd estimate that Ozma is "on stage" no more than 8-10 hours total, which is a not unreasonable length of time to be in a state of shock. ******************END SPOILER******************************* David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 19:17:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-02-96 Tyler: In _Santa Claus_, Zurline is the Queen of the Wood-Nymphs, not the Fairies. The Fairy Queen is un-named in that book. Personally, I believe that Lurline, Lulea, and the Fairy Queen in _Santa Claus_ are all the same character. Zurline is someone different. Dave: When is the Locasta story going to be available, and who is publishing it? -Nathan Mulac DeHoff ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 17:18:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-02-96 > From: Nathan DeHoff > Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-01-96 > > Eric: > Hope to see the _Queen Ann_ sequel soon! Me, too... > From: DavidXOE@aol.com > Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-01-96 > > Eric: > It's true that the forest isn't actually moved in the published version of > QUEEN ANN, but Ozma says it will be, and that means it surely happened, > right? Hey, even Ozma may get it wrong at times. There may have been unexpected complications... Oops, Kabumpo's coming, and he looks like he's in a stamping mood... > Rich: > I think it's fairly easy to understand why other Oz writers have returned to > Oogaboo more than to other Oz sites - it's a reasonably complete, well-set-up > small kingdom, and there aren't many of those in PD as yet...Jinxland and the > Hyup country are so isolated that they'd be > difficult... They're no more isolated than Oogaboo. > From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> > Subject: Today's Growls > > Eric - you have let slip you have a job - the "payday" reference. So is it in > teaching or are you designing WWW pages for a living? Since only two people here have asked (and one or two privately -- to which I privately responded), I'll just assume most people don't want to know and leave it at that for now... --Eric Gjovaag ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 22:41:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-02-96 Dave - Congrats on new computer! I'm getting one too, I hope on Friday, but I'll be sticking to a Mac (even though my friends think those will soon be obsolete...) Barbara - If you do find out where in Boston that little exhibit will be, do tell! Hmm. I think it would be interesting to have Maguire challenged by someone who is really up on her/his Ozzy history. Jane, have you read his book? In any case, please report to us and tell us what his talk was like! October 19th... there's that date again :-) (my birthday). |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com http://www.scso.com/~gili ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 4, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ============================================================================= Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 04:32:38 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy DIgest Nathan: I would welcome any reviews of Buckethead books by you. A rating is not required, of course. I only ask that you either use the one in place now or use nothing. This is not to force people to think like me, but rather to give a uniform scale so that people can get a consensus among people who do rate them. If you choose not to rate books, then that does not apply. To send me a review, just write it up and mail it to me privately. While I accept negative reviews, I ask that you be obejctive in your writing. Steve: The Queen of the Faries is named Zurline in _Santa Claus_. I used to think that Lurline, Zurline and Lulea were all the same person, but I no longer do, since they appear to behave different and have different powers and responsibilities. Aaron, Steve and mythology: I have always been under the impression that mythology is a very hodgepodge collection of stories and tales, many of which contradict each other and sometimes give the same god/goddess different characteristics and manifestations. I do not know if there is an "official" greek mythology against which other stories can be checked. Danny: Your point has been noted before by people, although neve mentioned in the digest, IIRC. Neill's work started to drop off toward the end of RPT and was quite inferior to his early work. David and Nathan: Another possible explanation is that different passes were used in the books. WHile it is mentioned somewhere that there is only one pass in and out of Oogaboo, this information was probably given by the Oogaboos themselves. They rarely if ever leave their country and few visit, so it is possible that there are many passes through the mountains and people may actually use two of them while believing they used the same one! David: Bob Up stayed in Oz because he had nothing to go home to, unlike Peter and Speedy. Button-Bright apparantly had a family, and he even went back to them once, after _Road_, but for some unexplained reason, he stayed after his adventure in _Scarecrow_. Also, I got your message to my old address and you should have recieved my reply. It is strange that my old account still works. They told me that it would be killed two weeks after I started with my new address, and I have been here at least 15 days. However, it may be destroyed at any time, so please if anybody sends me private e-mail, do so at my new address. Ken H: I believe Roquat/Ruggedo was dunked three times in the Fountain, at the end of _Emerald City_, _Magic_ and _Gnome King_. Maybe Rug changed his name on purpose to symbolize his "rebirth" after regaining his memories the first time and saw to reason to change again after his successive dunks. Nathan: MOPPeT is that the gypsies had a spot-protection spell that rendered the sands in their area harmless. Whether you like this one or your theory that the gypsies themselves were protected amounts to the same thing, except that with the second, people cannot visit their lands without the same spell. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 10:01:33 -0400 From: DIXNAM@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest 10-3-96 Dave: I second Gili's congrats on your new computer. (But with Windows '95/96 you now have the features of an '85 Mac!) Like David Hulan, I got anxious when the Digest didn't appear for two days in a row. I feared it had gone the way of its predecessors. (:-( Gili: Don't believe what your friends are telling you. Mac's are NOT becoming obsolete. Apple's hierarchy just has to get it's act together. And wasn't your "sleeping cat" done by Felix Lee? Dick Randolph ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 09:07:59 -0700 From: "Stephen J. Teller" Subject: OZ: Thompsonian Series Rich: I feel CAPTAIN SALT should be considered a part of (or at least an appendage to) the Peter series of RPT's books, because it contains on characters who were not *introduced* in PIRATES. Besides that, Captain Salt and Ato discuss the point that Tandy is not the comrade that Peter was. Its only links to Oz are through the Peter books. PURPLE PRINCE and SILVER PRINCESS do have the Red Jinn, who was introduced in JACK PUMPKINHEAD, but they are part of the KABUMPO series (somehow I never considered LOST KING a part of that series even though Kabumpo does play a fairly large role in that book). Anyway, PP especially has many other links to earlier Oz books, unlike C. SALT. SP is clearly a sequel to PP. For those interested in Myth and Language, the Semetic word "Adon," from which both Adonai and Adonis derive, simply means Lord (the opposite of Lady, not THE LORD). The Semetic root for G-d is El. Tyler: You are correct in saying there is no "official" Greek mythology. The text I current use in my mythology class is Powell's CLASSICAL MYTHOLOGY which gives much information on the sources of each myth. The indispensible guide to all the varients on the myths is Robert Graves THE GREEK MYTHS; he gives all the versions of each myth, but his interpretations of the myths are contraversial (fortunately he separates the telling of the myths and the interpretations in each of his 171 chapters). Actually some of my students did not like Graves because they wanted to know "which was the right version." Dave: I just added OZ to my subject line, I hope this makes things easier. BTW I read the 10/3 post before the 10/2 one, it makes things interesting. BTW any Gilbert and Sullivan fans in Ozzy land: I subscribed to the SAVOYNET last Friday and have already received over 100 postings. It bounces the messages directly to the subscribers. I am thinking of dropping it because I have hardly time to skim the postings. My first love remains OZ. Steve T. ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 08:36:10 -0600 (CST) From: Ruth Berman Subject: ozzy digest David Hulan: On artists and deterioration in eyesight -- even without any special eye-troubles, don't most artists start finding it harder to handle minute detail-work when they hit bifocal age? I think I remember seeing an interview in which Pauline Baynes commented on how she could no longer easily do the kind of detailed drawings she had done for the Narnia books. // I think you're right in suggesting that Ozma's tears and excitement in "Lost King" are reasonable reactions in the context of the story -- finding a parent thought long dead is something that would make most people emotional. [more "Lost King" discussion, assuming familiarity with story] Actually, I'm surprised at the amount of dislike some of the digesters have expressed for "Lost King." I'd agree that the death penalty for Mombi is unwarranted, and a flaw in the story, but it seems to me that it's small compared to the story's good qualities -- especially the comic contrasts of the ways both Pajuka and Kabumpo, judging people by appearances, both keep going wrong, but go wrong in opposite directions (Pajuka accepting Humpy as the Lost King, and Kabumpo holding that Humpy has no worthwhile qualities), and Humpy, too, because he keeps judging what he sees by screen cliches, keeps getting appearance and reality mixed up, but in different ways. Kimbaloo, one of RPT's typically royal-and-democratic townlets (with its button-and-bouquet based economy), is attractive, too, and so is getting to know more about the past of Oz. [end discussion assuming familiarity with plot] I had more to say about "Lost King," but I'm not sure if I should go ahead and assume that I should say it if I choose, or wait longer for the Club to use it. I think it's a dead project, and I might as well go ahead and use it myself. It's a bit long for the Digest, but would make a nice contribution for the Oz Research Group, maybe. With Fred still recovering from illness, though, I'm not sure whom to ask. Fred, a few years back, thought it would be a nice project to take the essays that had been written for the Club's reprints of various Oz books, and add in essays on some of the other books, to make up a volume of introductions/essays to be published by the Club. (In fact, the Club paid me for writing mine, which was on "Lost King," so at the time it looked as if the volume was something seriously intended for publication.) Anybody know if this project is still theoretically alive? Gili Bar-Hillel: I haven't seen "Angels in America," but would be interested in knowing about its Oz references, anyway. I remember from reviews of the play that it's about gays, and Judy Garland's Dorothy is something of an icon for gays, who tend to see coming out of the b&w Kansas world into Oz as a metaphor for "coming out of the closet." Which isn't all that relevant to the books, but it's still reasonably interesting. (Or is the topic of gay liberation one that would be too emotional, as likely to result in long digressions, whether pro or con or both, of no direct Oz interest?) Robin Olderman: Yes, Neill's artwork in "Peter and the Princess" is just gorgeous. (Grabo's story isn't particularly interesting, which is a pity.) Most of the time, I think Neill did most of his best artwork in b&w rather than color, but "Peter and the Princess," even more than "Sea Fairies" and "Emerald City," is an exception.// On differences between myth, folk tale, fairy tale, and fable -- they overlap a good deal. Myths are the stories out of a religion system. (In a more general sense, the story of how the Pilgrims and Indians celebrated the First Thanksgiving, although historically accurate -- well, sort of -- is an American culture myth, the story-explaining-a-cult-practice, in this case, the practice of having Thanksgiving dinner.) A fairy tale is one kind of folk tale -- except, of course, that an "art fairy tale" by a single known writer isn't a "folk" tale. In theory, writers could do, say, art-saints-legends or art-town-of-fools stories, but most of the time, writers who've drawn on folk tales have been drawing on fairy tales. (And fables are stories that make clear moral points, but beast-fables tend to shade off into fairy tale.) So you won't find any really clear sets of definitions, with so much overlap, but maybe these comments help a bit. I don't know of any one book that goes into the topic, but your friend might want to look up Marianne Thalman's book on the art fairy tale, introductory chapters of Fraser's "Golden Bough" and Robert Graves' Greek myths, other compendiums of Greek myth, encyclopedias of folklore, and such like. (Tolkien's essay is helpful, too, although you're right that it doesn't include a set of definitions.) ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 11:09:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-03-96 David: It is quite true that we do not know if Bucky has any surviving relatives. As far as I can remember, all we know is that his ancestors have been pilots and captains for many generations. The tugboat on which he began the adventure may have belonged to a family member, but all the other passengers might have been killed during the boiler explosion. Button-Bright and Trot both have parents, even though they go to Oz to live. As for Jenny Jump, we know nothing about her family, but the book does state that she lived alone. How did she support herself, or buy the pepper-cheese? Also, we do not know about Betsy Bobbin's family. Her family might have been on the ship when it sank. -N. M. D. ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 13:55:22 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-03-96 Rich: I bow to your superior knowledge of the comics field. I remembered the rhyming cop, and the name Clancy, but was obviously wrong in joining them. (Hey, it was 50 years ago, more or less, and I'm not a comics fan; I just read them when I was a kid.) Besides the uniform Neill shows, Peter specifically says that he's a Scout in PIRATES, and you're right, they had to be at least 12 in those days. (One reason I was never very active in Boy Scouts myself was that the year I turned 12 was the year they lowered the age to 11, so that I got in at the same time as a bunch of Little Kids and it wasn't as much fun...) I suppose it's theoretically possible Peter was just a Cub Scout, if they had Cubs as far back as 1930; I don't know about that. But he certainly acts more like a 13-14-year-old in PIRATES than an 11-year-old. Robin: I don't know about the technical definitions, if there are any, but given an example I can recognize whether I consider it a myth, a folk tale, or a fairy tale (or possibly more than one). To be a myth, I think that some fairly substantial group of people at some point in time had to believe that the story was literally true. (And the people who are talking about it have to believe that it isn't literally true.) Folk tales and fairy tales aren't mutually exclusive; some stories, like "Snow White" for instance, are both. Folk tales are anonymous stories that have been handed down by oral tradition for at least part of their history; they may or may not include supernatural elements. Fairy tales are a little harder to separate from fantasy in general; Tolkien gave a definition in his essay, but I'm not sure that it either includes everything that most people think of when they hear the term "fairy tale", or excludes everything that they don't. For one thing, I don't think Tolkien anticipated the enormous efflorescence of adult fantasy that, to a considerable degree, he inspired. Books like de Camp's THE GOBLIN TOWER and Asprin's ANOTHER FINE MYTH probably meet all of Tolkien's criteria, but I don't think they qualify as fairy stories. I am not, however, a literary expert in any sense of the word. I just read a lot and think about it some. But I don't often read what other people think on the same subjects, so I don't know if there's any kind of consensus among those who do. Maybe Steve or Ken S. or someone else with an advance degree in English Lit can shed some light. Nathan: Since Dave didn't answer you himself, LOCASTA is going to be published by Buckethead when BEOO has enough money to finance it and it reaches the top of the queue. So buy lots of Buckethead books and it'll come out sooner. (If there's more definite information on the subject it'll have to come from Chris D. or Dave.) Eric: I was just doing a little MIKADO allusion there; I realize that in fact Ozma can say something will happen and then it doesn't. I consider Jinxland and the Hyup country more isolated than Oogaboo. You can get to Oogaboo on foot, and people have done so both in and out of the FF. Jinxland and the Hyup country, however, are only accessible by air or magic. David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 13:09:15 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-03-96 Eric wrote: >>Someone asked me, "What's the 'Oz Kids Collection'?" Since there may be others wondering, I'll let everyone know here. "The Oz Kids" is a cartoon series produced over the last couple of years by Hyperion Animation, who made "The Brave Little Toaster." The head (forgot his name) is a life-long Oz fan. The series has already been shown abroad (Gili's seen it in Israel, right?), but no American distributor has been found yet, so while they keep looking they're releasing them on video. Willard Carroll is the life-long Oz fan you refer to. "The Oz Kids" will be released on TV in '98, per Hyperion's agreement with Paramount, IIRC. David: I wonder how many of us will respond about that statement of Trot's being an orphan. She lived with her mother. ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 15:02:48 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest David and Eric: Ozma mentioning that the forest *will* be moved is sufficient to make me believe that it will be (or was, from our time's perspective). I use a similar example from _Land_ when discussing Mombi's magical strength. Near the end of _Land_, Glinda says that after Mombi restores Ozma, she will force Mombi to drink a poition which will eliminate Mombi's magical power. While we do not actually witness the drinking, it is unlikely that Glinda forgot to do this and I assume that after that story, Mombi no longer has any magical power. David: With luck, we will see some Pumperdinkian stories within a year and a half. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 13:13:09 +0200 From: Bill Wright Subject: Received the following email at my Ozzy website. Think it should be of interest to Digest members. Please respond directly to Elizabeth (unless she becomes a member of the Digest.........Dave??) Thanks, Bill in Ozlo -----------begin message--------- I am an English teacher, and am going to teach the Wizard of Oz as a semester theme to my limited English students. I've been searching everywhere on the web. Finally found your wonderful site but would love to find someone who has a copy of the 2 movies done by NBC and ABC about Baum. We've called NBC to get a tape of it but no one seems to be able to help us. I bet an Oz fan might have it somewhere out there. We're going to make our 8th grade kids Oz maniacs - and would even like to see an Oz pen pal email club possible from your site. Thanks Elizabeth Blackadar lizstull@fia.net ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 20:30:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: TODAY'S OZ GROWLS RICH - It is all in the way it is presented for me. Regarding the "footpath." Dorothy clicks her heels and is transported by magic. I don't have a bit of trouble with that. RPT creates this bridge with legs, people climb on it and the thing takes off for the EC at over 2100 mph. I have trouble with that. To me that is just silly, not magic. IMHO. David - You would have stayed in Oz? Where would you find any books to read? Particularly mysteries! I don't recall ever seeing any in Oz. What good would it be to live forever if there is nothing new to read? Ah, I see another book for you - "The Authors of Oz." :) Scientifically, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 22:27:39 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest Rich: Your theory that Rug regained his memory on his own, as opposed to being "re-educated" by his fellow Nomes, is boslerted by the fact that he regained his memory and personality after _MAgic_ while living in the Emerald City, surrounded by Ozites. Of course, someone suggested that Glegg secretly restored his memories as part of his plan in _Kabumpo_. According to HACC theory, Peter and Speedy were 9 in their debut books and 13 in their final books in the FF, which is why the dates of occurence for those books are not compressed the wasy the first part of the series is. Eric: Oh, No! Windows 95! I myself spent an entire weekend getting the thing going, so I know how much fun you guys are going to have :-) Also, I'll add my plea fo you to inform the digest of your new job and start the ball rolling by saying that I have rejoined the ranks of the employed as a software designer for a viedo-conferencing compnay. Robin: ***** Random thoughts only, nothing "official" ***** myth: a story involving "powers", as they are called in D&D. Usually stories about creation or stories about the lives of the gods after creation. Folk Tale: A story involving the culture, people and/or legends of the local area. fable: a completely made-up story, with some sort of lesson or moral to be learned at the end. Fairy Tale: a story involving magic, fairies and other "mythical" creatures, but rarely gods and such. Kind of like Sci-Fi/Fantasy lite. ***** End of ramblings and off-the-top-of-my-head-guesses ***** Nathan: I agree that Lulea and the fairy queen in _Santa Claus_ are the same, but I believe that Lurline is different. Despite both being from Burzee, they seem to have different responsiblities and powers. There may be many bands of fairies that are all slightly different, and while I beleive that Lulea, Lurline and Zurline are three different people, I believe they all know each other and are related as immortal beings, under the Supreme Master. Eric: While Oogaboo, Jinxland and the Hyup country are more or less equally isolated, Baum fleshed out Oogaboo more so than the Hyups. However, we do know a fair amount about Jinxland. Of course, since the Hyup country has barely been mentioned, a person could really expand it for us. Gili: It would be interesting if someone asked Maguire where he came up with all of these wonderful ideas for his book and what his response would be. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Friday 04-Oct-96 08:55:43 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things MY _LOCASTA_ BOOK: As David Hulan said, Buckethead will publish my book _Locasta and the Three Adepts of Oz_ as soon as Chris has the finances to do it. But _Locasta_ is pretty far down on Chris' current queue of books to go to press, and since he has to raise the funds to print each book in turn, I'm not optimistic that the book will be ready before Reera and Glenn's silver wedding anniversary ( unless someone cares to make a generous contribution to fund Chris' endevours??? :) ). OZ BADGE UPDATE: After many delays, I'm almost finished with the design for the Ozzy Digest Badge/tee-shirt, and I will send it Barbara for printing. BOOKS IN OZ: Bear wrote: >You would have stayed in Oz? Where would you find any books to read? Try Glinda's Great Library of Knowledge or the Wogglebug College Library. RUG'S MEMORY: There has been so much arguement about how Ruggedo regained his memory that I can't resist letting everyone in on what REALLY happpened (But be forewarned -- If you don't want *any* of _Locasta_ spoiled for you, DON'T READ THIS!): ********** SPOILER FOR _LOCASTA AND THE THREE ADEPTS OF OZ_ ********** After his memory loss at the end of _Magic_, Ruggedo lived happily as a friend of Oz until he found a spray can ( I'm NOT going to go into here how a spray can got into 1920's Oz :) ) and sprayed it, releasing Taarna the Terrible, an All-Powerful Genie. Taarna was once a major threat to Oz until Mombi (of all people!) imprisoned her in the spray can. As you may have surmised, Taarna longs to avenge her long imprisonment by devestating Oz! But she is the slave of her liberator, Ruggedo, who has no ambition to harm Oz, his having lost his memory and now being a "wimpo goody-goody". So Taarna's only chance is to make Ruggedo use one of his three wishes of the genie to make himself evil again, so that he'll command Taarna to conquer Oz. So after a lot of cajoling and intimidation, she finally persuades Ruggedo to wish for his memory to be restored, which she does, and also renders him permanently immune to the Water of Obilvion. But the now-evil Ruggedo, seeing Taarna as a rival, immediately stuffs Taarna back into her can, throws it into a gravel pit, and marches off to write his history in rock (thus begins _Kabumpo_). Only many years later (when most of my story takes place) does Ruggedo and Taarna's paths once again cross, and they finally form an alliance. *********************** END SPOILER ********************************** GILBERT AND SULLIVAN IN OZ: Steve T. wrote: >I subscribed to the SAVOYNET last Friday and have already >received over 100 postings ... I am thinking of dropping it >because I have hardly time to skim the postings. My >first love remains OZ. I too am a member of SAVOYNET, but frequently delete it unread because I just don't have the time to read it...Oz is top priority for me as well! :) -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 5, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ============================================================================= Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 12:50:21 +0200 From: Bill Wright I have received a request from a high school looking to find the script and songs to put on a WizOz play this year. Could someone send me an email of the name and address of where they should go to obtain this. I know this has been posted on the Digest sometime in the past, put silly me, I forgot to note it somewhere I could find it easily. Bill in Oz ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 13:03:29 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-04-96 Thanks for the help about myth, folk tale, and fairytale. I'm going to copy all of your comments into a ClarisWorks document and give it to my friend. The boundaries do blur, don't they. ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 15:12:24 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest 10-04-96 Ruth: You're probably right - I'm not an artist (of the type who draws pictures, at least), so I've no idea how the general aging process would affect the ability to draw fine detail. I like LOST KING quite a lot; it's my favorite of the early Thompsons by a considerable margin. I don't think she wrote anything as good before YELLOW KNIGHT, or possibly even OJO. It has flaws, but so does every Oz book with the possible exception of MERRY-GO-ROUND (which I think is the best-crafted of the FF but which, to me, doesn't have a very Ozzy feel to it). That collection of essays/introductions to all the Oz books sounds like a really good project for the Club, though I'm not sure there'd be enough demand for it to justify printing it with a full binding and such. But if the authors would contribute their services for free, it should be possible to photocopy it so it could sell for only a few dollars, and so it could be reprinted easily as copies ran out without a serious capital investment. (I'm thinking something more along the lines of FANCYCLOPEDIA II than THE WIZARD OF WAY-UP.) Nathan: The tug whose boiler blew up and threw Bucky into the Oz universe did belong to his uncle, though it's not clear whether or not he was on the boat when the explosion happened. Robin: I didn't say Trot was an orphan. She not only had a living mother, but a living father, at least in SKY ISLAND; he succeeded Cap'n Bill as captain of the ship they'd both sailed on after Cap'n Bill lost his leg. I said, "After Trot and Button-Bright, the only children who stayed in Oz in the FF were orphans." Trot and Button-Bright weren't orphans, we don't know about Betsy, and Dorothy, though an orphan, had a family she was devoted to. But all the children -after- Trot and Button-Bright who stayed were orphans. (At least, I assume Jenny was an orphan because she lived alone. Maybe it was just that she had such a bad temper her parents kicked her out...) Bear: I have great confidence that there are plenty of books to read in Oz. And when I was a kid, I was much less selective in what I was willing to read. Hey, I even read a thing or two by Dickens back then before my tastes firmed up! :-) Tyler: Glad to hear that you're back among the employed! (Not that I don't find -not- being among the employed quite delightful, myself, but then I don't need to be employed to eat...) All: Well, I'm off out of town for the next five days; I'll probably be back in time to read the accumulated Digests Wednesday, but it'll be Thursday or maybe later before I have time to respond to them. Au revoir! David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 15:33:25 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest It looks like I accidentally sent a post twice. This may have been due to a temporary glitch that created a delay in sending mail, but I believe that has been fixed, so you will only see my words once. Nathan: In some Buckethead book, it is mentioned that Betsy's parents have been transported to Oz, although they are very minor characters. Speaking of this, we have been talking about BEOO publising Oz books. Chris relies on sales of earlier Oz books to finance publication of new Oz books. You can go to my web page and see all of the available BEOO books and reviews of some of them, which you can add to by writing a review and mailing it to me. Dave and Bill: It would be cool to get that English Teacher (and by extension, her 8th grade class) on the digest. Bear: I'm sure that if you asked Ozma sweetly, she would provide a library for you that magically updates itself every now and then. Also, in _Patchwork Girl_, Dorothy is reading a book in Chapter 16. In the Laumerian Oz, Ozma magically created a library for the Wogglebug and his college. All: I specifically avoided Dave's explanation of Rug's memory, so I will also avoid theorizing on it anymore and I would like to beg everyone who DID read the post to keep mum about it for a while, please :-) --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 17:20:33 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-04-96 Steve: I agree that _Lost King_ does not really seem to be part of the Kabumpo series. He is more of a "special guest star," as Humpy might say. Ruth: _Lost King_ is actually one of my favorite Oz books. It is sometimes a little tough to keep track of the multiple plots, though. Even Thompson has some trouble with this. When Dorothy meets the Scooters, one of these rivermen says, "It's only ten o'clock." After she leaves the Scooters, she meets Kabumpo. That same morning, at "nearly nine o' clock," Snip awakens in Blankenburg, and soon learns from Tora that, "An elephant has run off with a little girl." Unless it takes Snip an hour to reach Tora's shop, which seems quite unlikely, there is a mistake here (not too major, I'll admit, but somewhat annoying). David: Jinxland may not be as isolated today as it was in the time of _Scarecrow_. In _Grampa_, the Army of Ragbad marches to Jinxland, and they probably do not have any magic to help them cross the Great Gulf. Is it possible that a bridge was built over the Gulf? Bear: There are probably plenty of books in Oz. The ones that grow on trees might be inconvenient, as they wither once read. However, the Public Library of Oz probably has quite a collection, and, if Umbrella Island ever visits Oz, you could always borrow some from Gureeda. --Nathan M. DeHoff ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 16:20:45 -0700 From: Robert.Shepherd@West.Sun.COM (Bob Shepherd) Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-04-96 Hi All - It seems that a day doesn't go by without hearing some reference to Oz! Just yesterday I heard Paul Harvey on the radio say that the #1 video that people are buying to keep is (you guessed it) _The Wizard of Oz_ (isn't that wonderful?). Going home I heard an advertisement for a video store chain (Hollywood Video) that used a Judy Garland impersonator that started out with "There's no place like Hollywood Video, there's no place like Hollywood Video!", continued on with various other references to the movie, and concluded with "Toto, I don't think we're in just any ol' video store anymore!" It's amazing how much Oz has been woven into our everyday culture and lexicon. Bob Shepherd ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 21:13:33 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: TODAY'S OZ GROWLS Ruth - Your question about the Oz Research Group is curious? See as follows: Date: Thu, 05 Sep 1996 10:07:12 -0600 (CST) From: Ruth Berman Subject: ozzy digest Regarding previous discussion of Cheeriobed as the King of the Munchkins -- it dawns on me that I never did print the article I wrote on the subject several years back anywhere. It's rather too long to contribute to the Digest, but I've typed it up with some revisions and sent it to the Oz Research Group for their fall (post office) mailing. There's a good deal of overlap between the Digest and the OzRG, but in case there are some here who would enjoy it and are not in it -- it's run by Andrea Kelman Yussman, 2800 Rockhaven Ave, Louisville KY 40220. Archivally speaking, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 22:07:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-03-96 Rich Morrissey: That little digression about comics was a perfect example of how interesting digresstions can be... you seem to ahve fascinating friends! Robin: Myth, folktale, fairy tale or fable are sometimes used interchangeably, so dfining them can get a bit confusing. Here's my best shot: MYTH: a. a story with religious significance, usually part of a larger canon or mythology, esp. Greek mythology. As you yourself suggested, myths often serve to explain why the world is so. b. any story or tale that is part of a common cultural heritage, not neceassarily religious. In this sense, The Wizard of Oz is a myth, because it has so infiltrated American society that images from it serve as cultural icons. (which needs further explanation, but I think you get the idea). FOLK TALE: Stories belonging to an oral tradition that is passed down from generation to generation. Folk tales seldom deal with gods, and are more likely to deal with common people or with animals than myths are. However, like the looser sense of myths, Folktales reflect a common cultural heritage. Fairy Tales: Folk tales that have been written down, esp. the flowery type of folktales dealing with princesses and fairies as favoured by Charles Perrault (sp?). Fairy Tales are more closely linked with the modern "fantasy" genre than folktales, but, again, folktales and fairy tales are often interchangeable. FABLES: stories with an allegorical meaning and a moral. Esp. those written by Aesop. These are very loose definitions of course, based more on my intuition than on my academic knowledge. Again, these terms are often used interchangeably. I haven't even finished reading yesterday's digest, not to mention today's, but I've got to go now so that looks like all for today! Gili |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com http://www.scso.com/~gili ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 04:47:47 +0000 From: Scott Olsen Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-04-96 Re: Ruth's essay on Lost King: I think it would be a great idea to see all the essays published in a single volume. I look forward to seeing yours someday, in one form or another. Michael Hearn's essay about RPT/Ozoplaning that appeared awhile back in the Bugle was excellent. Re: Like/Dislike of Lost King: I'm afraid I'm one of those who, if asked to name their favorite 14 Oz books, would name the 14 Baum books first. (I even like the "boring" parts in Emerald City...) But, for what it's worth, I remember quite a while back none other than the late great Oz historian, Fred Otto, telling me that Lost King was one of his favorites, if not THE favorite of the FF. I've always preferred Kabumpo. So much for the "Thompson got better with the later books" theory. (Although I personally cannot accept most of the premise of Royal Book.) Sincerely, Scott Olsen ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 00:05:33 -0500 From: International Wizard of Oz Club Subject: RE: Paper products Offhand I don't know what is currently available, but Hallmark does = license some of the movie art and photographs. I'm forwarding your = question to the "Ozzy Digest" mailing list in hopes of a more complete = response. Sincerely yours, Jim Vander Noot ---------- From: HBurton739@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 1996 10:23 PM To: iwoc@neosoft.com Subject: Paper products I live in Louisville, Ky. and am having a birthday party for my three = year old daughter. She wants Wizard of Oz paper products for her party such = as plates, napkins and cups. I can't find them anywhere. Do they make = them? If so, would you please tell me where I might find or order them? I'm running out of time. HELP! Thanks. HBurton@AOL.com ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 00:09:41 -0500 From: International Wizard of Oz Club Subject: RE: (no subject) Lauren, That's a good question. The two printed copies of the screen play that = I have merely refer to the guards chanting without any specific text. = I'm sending a copy of your note to the Oz mailing list in hopes of a = better answer. Sincerely, Jim Vander Noot ---------- From: Lauren Deane Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 1996 7:59 AM To: info@ozclub.org Subject: (no subject) Hi! I am writing from an elementary school in Pennsylvania. We need confirmation on a triva question about the movie version of the Wizard of Oz. When the guards are entering the witch's castle...what are=20 they chanting? Can you help? Thanks, Lauren Deane- Media Specialist Oak Lane Day School oaklane@pond.com ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 00:22:40 -0500 From: International Wizard of Oz Club Subject: RE: suggestions Hi, Allie's mom, I just returned from vacation and got your note. It sounds like lots of = fun! (Pin the tail on the Cowardly Lion?) I realize it's pretty late = in the game, but I'm passing this along to a group of Oz fans for = comment. Sincerely, Jim Vander Noot ---------- From: TristonJ@aol.com Sent: Friday, September 27, 1996 9:02 PM To: info@ozclub.org Subject: suggestions Hi Folks, My daughter is turning 6 in a few weeks. We are having a Wizard of Oz = Bday party. She is really excited as her mind is afire with Oz ideas--some = not too practical nor easily to actualize. I'm writing to request any suggestions you may have in terms of activities (girls love crafts), = games, favors etc...I did get some intersting thoughts while online regarding a ruby/emerald/ and yellow theme, and the party girl will be all dressed = as Dorothy. We've made invitations and have preliminary ideas. Our quite lengthy brick walkway is being "shaded" yellow as we speak--let's hope = it doesn't rain!) Any advice would be terrific. Thanks in advance. And..... If anyone there gets a chance, an E-mail from your Club would be a = memorable extra on that day!!! (Allie turns 6 on 10/10/96: Her party is on = 10/6/96) Allie's mom ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 6, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ============================================================================= Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 07:07:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-05-96 > From: Bill Wright > > I have received a request from a high school looking to find the script > and songs to put on a WizOz play this year. Could someone send me an > email of the name and address of where they should go to obtain this. I > know this has been posted on the Digest sometime in the past, put silly > me, I forgot to note it somewhere I could find it easily. I have no idea if they have an e-mail address, but the amateur stage rights are held by Tams-Whitmark. IT shouldn't be too hard to find their address in the drama section of any decent-sized library. > From: International Wizard of Oz Club > Subject: RE: (no subject) > > Lauren, > > That's a good question. The two printed copies of the screen play that = > I have merely refer to the guards chanting without any specific text. = > I'm sending a copy of your note to the Oz mailing list in hopes of a = > better answer. Don't bother now, gang. I got the same question (from the same person), and answered it already. And it WILL be appearing in version 1.1 of my FAQ, if I can ever get around to that @#$!! upgrade... BTW, the chant IS printed on page 111 of the Delta Books version of the screenplay, published in 1989, edited and with an introduction by Michael Patrick Hearn. --Eric Gjovaag ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 12:53:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-05-96 Regarding Betsy's Family: In Ryan Gannaway's _Time-Travelling in Oz_, it is stated that Betsy's immediate family was blown away in a tornado, and that she was sailing to England, where her relatives lived, when the storm that brought her to the Rose Kingdom occurred. "Bobbin" certainly sounds like an English name, but access to the Nonestic Ocean is usually gained through the Pacific, and it seems rather doubtful that a ship would be sailing to England across the Pacific. I have recently finished reading _The Crocheted Cat in Oz_, a book published by Buckethead Enterprises. I may have a review for the Digest soon. --Nathan M. DeHoff ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 17:20:12 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Today's Oz Growls Tyler/Nathan - Glad to hear there will be something to read when I get there. Baum hadn't enlightened me. As you know I am still working through RPT. It will be a long time until Laumer. Tyler - Let me know if March 28th arrived and was received. Weekend regards, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 17:30:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-04-96 Hi digest and party parents! I think that the questions Jim has forwarded to us have been asked often enought to merit being added to Ozzy FAQs everywhere. I. The party question: My child wants the Wizard of Oz as a party theme.Any suggestions? did anyone keep the suggestion that came in about six months ago? I remember a girl who was twelve or eleven had some absolutely marvellous ideas - I don't remember her name! Here's a list of the ideas that I do remember: 1. Using Ozzy colors: green for emerald city, yellow blue red and purple for the counties. 2. "pin the tail on the cowardly lion" 3. Frothy pink good witch shake, dark green bad witch punch. 4. Decorating with poppies and sunflowers (how about little bunches of straw, tin funnels, and pawprints?) 5. Decorating paper cups and name cards with Ozzy stickers (such as those printed by Dover) 6. Invitations on Ozzy greeting cards or postcards (with Georgia O'Keefe poppy stamps?) 7. Specially decorated cake, either bakery made after an existing illustration, or just use yellow icing to make a path and stick plastic dolls on it. 8. I like the idea of chalking the path to the house yellow! 9. Using the "cut out and fold" emerald city diorama desgined by Dick Martin and Published by Dover (If you can find it!) as a centerpiece for the table. 10. Dressing up as Dorothy is easy: braids, blue checked dress and a toy dog. Most costume shops have Dorothy costumes. Shoes could be wrapped in generous quantities of tinfoil, or red shoes, depending on which version of Oz you prefer (book or movie). 11. Face painting: Lion is your basic cat, scarecrow is a colored nose and big circles round the eyes, tin man could have jaws outlined in black and little circles for bolts at the hinges, and Dorothy is just lipstick and pink cheeks or something cute like that. Specifically for Allie's mom, who asked about Ozzy crafts: I know there are a lot of Ozzy stickers and rubber stamps out there. At one of the Oz Club conventions Kids were using those to make Ozzy bookmarks out of strips of thick white paper: they punched holes on top and tied little pieces of green ribbon in them to make them look fancier. Dorothy had a basket she carried around in the book: maybe get some of those plastic berry baskets from a supermarket, and have the girls weave colored yarn through the holes to make a basket like Dorothy's. II. What are the Winkie guards chanting in the movie? We should givethe official answer as in the filmscript edited by Michael Hearn (Eric,could you look that up again?) which is the nonsense syllables; mention the similarity to the song of the Volga boatmen; and give the cute variants that some people prefer: "All we own, we owe her!" etc. and in response to other digest postings: Dick Randolph - YES! Thank you. How come you remembered who designed my cat, and I didn't? :-) Tyler - what does "boslerted" mean? For once in my life, I wasn't even able to guess at your original intent... |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com (cat by Felix Lee) http://www.scso.com/~gili ====================================================================== Date: Saturday 05-Oct-96 22:37:01 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things Thanks Gili! I may add the answers you contributed to the next FAQ... :) I accidentially destroyed my master copies of the Digest for October 4 & 5! Could someone please send them to me so I can forward them to those who have requested them? -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 7, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ============================================================================= Date: Sun, 06 Oct 1996 03:36:30 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest Nathan: What you say is very true. While it is not excruciatingly important that Dorothy punch a clock on her adventures, it does help the story if things like that add up. Little things still count, if only a little bit. :-) Nathan again: I like the idea of a bridge over the gulf to Jinxland. Not only is it possible, it is quite probable. Before, the king had a reason to want his country isolated. Nowadays, with a good ruler, they would probably want more contact with the main body of Oz, and I'm sure Glinda or the Wizard could easily construct a bridge or two. As far as I know, there has only been one non-FF book concerning Jinxland. This is _The Gardeners Boy of Oz_, one of the best BEOO books ever. Sadly, it is out of print. Maybe Chris remembers if this story mentioned a bridge. Hyup: We started by discussing the relative isolation of Oogaboo, Jinxland and the Hyup country. At the end of _Magic_, Kiki Aru stayed at EC, and I do not believe Ozma made any effort to locate his country. Therefore, it is highly likely that the Hyup country is as isolated and forgotten as ever. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 06 Oct 1996 07:16:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-06-96 > From: Gili Bar-Hillel > Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-04-96 > > Hi digest and party parents! > I think that the questions Jim has forwarded to us have been asked > often enought to merit being added to Ozzy FAQs everywhere. How about "The Wizard of Oz Party Book"? (No, *I* don't want to write it...) > II. What are the Winkie guards chanting in the movie? > > We should givethe official answer as in the filmscript edited by Michael Hearn > (Eric,could you look that up again?) which is the nonsense syllables; mention > the similarity to the song of the Volga boatmen; and give the cute > variants that some people prefer: "All we own, we owe her!" etc. Except for the "Volga Boatman" reference, all this WILL be up on my web site very soon, perhaps even tonight. Dave (and anyone else), you have my permission to copy my answer and put it in your FAQ. --Eric "So how do you like my new .sig?" Gjovaag ### Visit my "Wizard of Oz" web site! http://www.eskimo.com/~tiktok/ ### "Get out the time-fracture wickets, Hobbes! We're gonna play Calvinball!" --Calvin, "It's a Magical World," page 99 ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 06 Oct 1996 16:09:04 -0400 From: DIXNAM@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest 10-6-96 Gili: My remembering the designer of your "sleeping cat" is one of those things peculiar to us 'seasoned' citizens. Of course I can't remember what I ate for dinner last night, or where was an hour ago. I think it's called "Old-timers" disease! (:-) Dick Randolph ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 06 Oct 1996 21:11:33 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy DIgest Nathan: Most of the time, people go to Oz through the Pacific. If you subscribe to the Chris Dulabone/March Laumer theory, which states that Oz is physically on our planet and somewhere in the south pacific, then it is a little hard to get there from the Atlantic, where Betsy's ship probably would be if it was headed to England. If, however, you adhere to the other theroy, that Oz is in a parallel Earth, or perhaps a gravity well attached to Earth, then entrance to Oz may be had anywhere on our world with equal ease. Once you write your review of _Crocheted Cat_, would you alow me to post it on my web site? The same goes for all other people who have read BEOO books. Gili: The young lady's name was Katy Lau from Hawaii. Her comments were in the last few days of March. I no longer have these, but Bear is sending them to me slowly. THe 28th has been cut in half due to my habit of going off-line too quickly, but perhaps Bear himself may be inclined to look in those digests and find Katy's comments? BTW, boslerted is old Ozzish for bolstered, as in someone's theory was bolstered by other evidence from the FF. Dave: I have re-sent the 10-05 digest, still in original form, so you will get two sets of those wonderful internet headers. Prepare for 10-04, which I will copy from the October block. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Monday 07-Oct-96 01:15:18 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things Thanks to everyone who sent me copies of the 10-4 and 10-5 Digests as I requested...Now could th epeople who requested them from ME remind me who you are? :) Today's could be the shortest Digest ever!(?) -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 8, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Mon, 07 Oct 1996 09:32:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-07-96 Dick: Actually, I am still quite young, and my long-term memory is often better than my short-term. Tyler: In "Much Ado About Kiki Aru," a story in the 1986 Oziana, Bini Aru leaves Mount Munch to search for his son, and eventually finds him. If this account is correct, then Ozma may have established relations with Mount Munch. --Nathan M. DeHoff ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 07 Oct 1996 06:34:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: OZ stuff Dave, I was one of those who needed the 10/4 Digest. Everybody, the FAQ part of my web page is FINALLY up-to-date, and now everyone can read version 1.1. Next step fpr me is to set up my FTP site so it has stuff in it and people can download from it, then I'm going to add some pictures, then I hope to work on version 1.2 this summer. And yes, I did get all five "Oz Kids Collection" videotapes this weekend. --Eric "Now if I could only find time to WATCH them..." Gjovaag ### Visit my "Wizard of Oz" web site! http://www.eskimo.com/~tiktok/ ### ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 07 Oct 1996 09:23:24 -0600 (CST) From: Ruth Berman Subject: ozzy digest Bill Wright asked about script and songs to put on "Wizard of Oz" play, and Eric Gjovaag replied Witmark. A thought in case the high school would like some additional options -- the Samuel French company formerly published (non-musical) adaptations of "Wizard," "Land," "Ozma," and, surprisingly enough, "Enchanted Island of Yew." All are out of print, but they might perhaps be willing to sell photocopies (or be willing to grant permission to have photocopies made if a library to hand has copies). Come to think of it, their "Wizard" is so old that it must be approaching public domain. I wonder if the Club would have any interest in reprinting it when that happens. (I do have copies of these myself, so will try to remember to take a look at dates.) The Children's Theater Company of Minneapolis put on a musical version of "Land" some years back (some of you may have seen the videotape of it they produced). I don't know what their policies are on granting permissions to use their scripts, although I know of at least one occasion when another professional children's theater arranged to do CTC's version of "Babar." David Hulan: You may be right in thinking that something like spiral binding would be appropriate for a collection of introductions/essays. Within the Oz Club, the appeal of such a collection might be mostly to those members who have the older editions and don't really need the full reprints, but who would like to have just the new material. Bear: I'm puzzled by your comment to me, "Your question about the Oz Research Group is curious." I don't think I asked a question about it? (Perhaps you misread my question about whatever happened to the collection of introductions/essays the Oz Club had had planned?) // More about books in Oz. Nathan DeHoff mentioned the Public Library of Oz and Gureeda's books (these are in Neill's Oz books and RPT's "Speedy," respectively). Bob Pattrick wrote an interesting essay on books in Oz documenting the rather large number that turn up in one volume or another. The essay was included in the collection of his essays that the Oz Club published, "Unexplored Territory in (of?) Oz." I forget if it's currently available. ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 07 Oct 1996 12:49:52 -0400 (EDT) From: "Aaron S. Adelman" Subject: Theosophy and other strange theologies in Oz Empire Greetings! Having been in Philadelphia visiting Barry and with several Jewish holidays in the same month, I haven't had much of a chance to reply to the Digest, so be prepared for what I'm about to say to seem like old business. Concerning the "Mebesian heresies" thread, I really haven't heard anything before on theosophy, but is it anything like Baha'i? I've corresponded some with a Baha'ist over the Net, and they seem to have a religion that is basically the same as the given description of theosophy--recognizing all major religions as deriving from divine revelation, therefore giving legitimacy to all faiths. What I'm really curious about is how theosophy (or any such system) is able to deal with religions that deny the validity in whole or in part of other religions. E.g., my religion, Judaism, is a strict anti-idolatrous monotheism. Accepting Judaism automatically denies the polypostphasic Christianity, the dualistic Zoroastrianism, and the polytheistic or polypostphasic Hinduism. As such, I find it incredible that any ideology could claim validity for both Judaism and any contradictory religion without a) fudging the views of the various religions, or b) lying and hoping that no one notices the problems. =09Popping back out to Mebesian syncreticism, in this case Mebes attempted the solution of ignoring the problem. If he wants to go against Baum, that's his perogative. It's his failure to say why he thinks Baum is wrong that I dislike. =09Popping out to the topic of monotheism in Oz: 1) In _The Life and Adventures of Santa Claus_, reference is made to a Supreme Master who created the universe. (Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.)=20 Presumably this refers to God. 2) In _The Sea Fairies_, Anko claimed that Adam measured him when Cain was a baby. Assuming that Anko is not lying, this implicitly implies that a Western monotheism, such as Judaism, Christianity, or Islam, is THE TRUTH in the Oz universe. If, say, the ancient Greek or Roman religion were THE TRUTH, Adam and Cain, who do not exist in their mythos, would not have been able to meet Anko. Aaron. Aaron Solomon (ben Saul Joseph) Adelman adelman@yu1.yu.edu ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 07 Oct 1996 20:58:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Today's Oz Growls I'm not sure why you want it but here is the Lau post. Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 17:30 +0000 (WET) From: lti@lava.net (Linda Inouye) Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 03-29-96 Aloha, This is Katy Lau from Hawaii. I'm 12 and I've read all the Baum Oz books. I met Eric G on the Oz IRC (Chat) last year. I like to draw and maybe you'll see my drawings in the Oz Gazette or Emerald City Mirror someday. :-) "W. R. Wright" (Why are you piglet?) wrote: >Anyone on the Digest know of a source for WOZ theme birthday party supplies?? I had an Oz birthday cake last year. We bought Wizard of Oz plastic figures at Toys R Us (Where does that apostrophe go?) and put them on a birthday cake. The set we got came with Dorothy (and Toto in a basket), Cowardly Lion, Tin Man, Scarecrow, Glinda, and the Wicked Witch. I had green balloon decorations. You could also use green streamers and paper goods. Hallmark sells Wizard of Oz (MGM) stickers that could be used to decorate plastic cups, homemade invitations, or paper goodie bags. There's a whole bunch of cut out and assemble things like a WOZ theater, the Emerald City and nesting Oz dolls at Borders Bookstore. You could use these for a centerpiece, or to play with. One Christmas my mom made a treasure hunt with (paper) yellow brick road clues leading to some Ozzy presents. Here are some other ideas: * Use washable chalk to draw the yellow brick road on a sidewalk or driveway leading to your door. * Pin the tail on the Cowardly Lion, or Pin the heart on the Tin Man * Skip the plates and use "lunch boxes." :-) * Hang green streamers around your door and put a sign that says "Welcome to Emerald City." You could even hang a horseshoe-shaped magnet (the Love Magnet that comes in later books) over your door. * Use yellow playdough and those plastic Oz figures to play "going down the yellow brick road." My little brother who is 5, likes playing with figures in the playdough. * Green ice cream :-} yum! * Play the Oz soundtrack (musical chairs?) Katy Lau You can reach me at lti@lava.net, my mom's account. P.S. I'm going to Las Vegas next month. Any good Ozzy things that I shouldn't miss at the MGM? I'm also going to see the Oz ice show in Las Vegas. Was there a Digest dated October 6th? Maybe that is why I don't get the question. Regards, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 15:37:38 -0400 From: JOdel@aol.com Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, Have been lurking for a while and thought I'd stick my head up again for no very particular reason (apart from being stuck at home with a racked-up ankle today). On Oz as myth; Not a very satisfying deffinition from where I am standing. It does not explain any part of how the world, as it is, works. And, Lurline, et. als. notwithstanding, it does not deal with the gods or "powers" which the host culture recognizes (apart from Santa Claus). Nor does it deal with the interaction of human nature, as it is, and as it defines itself in folklore. I'd be more likely to regard it as falling within a hitherto undefined, but persistant, construct, which for convenience I'll refer to as wish-myth, which seems to crop up in a lot of cultures. The host culture typically recognizes that it may be "true" without being "real", since it no allowance is made for it within the local, and already established religious structure. These wish-myths, at least in post-industrial cultures, tend to grow out of art tales which somehow strike a particular resonance within the society. They last for several generations without ever really changing in character, and may or may not fade out afterwards. (Was Fiddlers' Green an actual piece of folklore, was it invented by Chesterton or some such?) They also seem to require a certain extended period to develop. The go-go Gandalf phase of Tolkien fandom, for example, looked like it might produce one, but even an abundance of mass-market tolklones never managed to push it over the barrier and it has returned to its literary roots. While the Star Trek universe will probably keep on chugging away for another 50 years. Quoted and noted; ...>You would have stayed in Oz? Where would you find any books to read?< Try Glinda's Great Library of Knowledge or the Wogglebug College Library. Dave Hardenbrook Interesting. A point I'd not considered. And neither of these sources really strike one as a potential source for *stories* either, do they? But, then, to a kid, I suspect that the promise was that things in Oz would be so interesting that I wouldn't have to stave off the omnipresent boredom with mere reading... And, yes, I recognize the assumption that reading was regarded as a deffinite second best to almost any kind of doing. But that WAS the commonly held public perception of the practice during the period that I was growing up. And probably a more long-lived and enduring one than we'd like to believe. Certainly, at that time the impression that I was given was that while Ma would grudgingly admit that reading was an acceptable waste of my time, she would have prefered that I be doing almost any sort of productive work, or even active play instead. Quite right that if it was wanted, a library would certainly be provided. I also find it interesting. that people keep making provocative comments to Gili. Well provocative to me anyway. Both of these somewhat off the subject of literary Oz, however. "...Don't believe what your friends are telling you. Mac's are NOT becoming obsolete. Apple's hierarchy just has to get it's act together." Dick Randolph Actually, the biggest part of the Mac/Apple problem in current public perception is that the paradigm has shifted and even die-hard Mac purists are being sluggish to respond. The "Mac" is the MacOS, rather than any piece of hardware, and while Apple develops and distributes it, Apple's statistics no longer perfectly reflect the Mac's market -- which is actually growing, slightly. Apple's slightly falling market share recently isn't a reflection of the triumph of Windows as much as it is an indication of the success of it's own clones. (The last two Mac/Windows comparisons I've seen used PowerComputing boxes for their examples. Against Compac, rather than IBM.) Unlike IBM, however, Apple at least provides the OS which their clones run. So they're still at least winning something in that round, if not anything nearly as much as when they provided the hardware as well. ...I haven't seen "Angels in America," but would be interested in knowing about its Oz references, anyway. I remember from reviews of the play that it's about gays, and Judy Garland's Dorothy is something of an icon for gays, who tend to see coming out of the b&w Kansas world into Oz as a metaphor for "coming out of the closet." Ruth Berman And I think I read somewhere that the Stonewall riot erupted during what the police evidently thought was a routine raid on the night of, or maybe the night of the day after Garland's funeral. ====================================================================== Date: Tuesday 08-Oct-96 13:39:54 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things I would like to get an idea, a "head count" as it were :) -- How many here on the Digest plan to buy my book, _Locasta and the Three Adepts of Oz_ when it comes out? -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 9, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 22:16:10 +0000 From: Scott Olsen Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-07-96 Re: Neill's Decline In Illustration Quality I have always thought that Neill's style changed throught the series, but I've never thought his illustrations became especally poor. I'm not an art expert (far from it) but I've always preferred his illustrations for Land and Ozma, then later for Lost Princess/Tin Woodman era. And the early 20's books are interesting in their use of black backgrounds. Neill's style changed so much, so frequently, and so quickly throughout the series, that a case could probably be made that Land, Ozma, and Road were illustrated by 3 different people. Anyone who has been fortunate to view original Neill art for the Oz books knows the illustrations were reduced about 1/3 for publication. (Therefore, I'm not sure if there's that much to the poor eyesight theory.) Regardless, this reduction allowed for some leeway in illustration quality. In other words, a close look at original illustrations sometimes reveals flaws that aren't easily seen in the books. For example, in the original illustration of Benny on page 44 of Giant Horse, it is very apparent Neill forgot to draw Benny's left index finger--then realized his mistake and scribbled it in. This minor error--very obvious in the original drawing--is hardly noticeable in the book. Sincerly, Scott Olsen ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 19:36:24 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-08-96 On Oz as myth: Actually, there are mythological elements in the Oz books, which relate to how the world works. Baum introduces the Rain King and the Rainbow. Neill writes about the Sky Sweepers, who keep the sky clean. There are probably many other examples, if one would care to look for them. Aaron: The existence of a Supreme Master (as Baum mentioned in _Santa Claus_) does not mean that there are no lesser Masters. Indeed, _Santa Claus_ speaks of three such Masters, Ak, Bo, and Kern. Also, the fact that Adam and Cain existed does not necessarily indicate that the Judeo-Christian God exists. Neither of these references successfully indicates that Baum's Oz was monotheistic. Dave: I shall probably purchase a copy of _Locasta and the Three Adepts_, provided I have a sufficient amount of money (usually Buckethead books are not all that expensive, so this will probably not be a problem). --Nathan M. DeHoff "I must ask you to leave everything in the disorder in which you find it." --Professor Wogglebug "Having an Emperor's spirit wished upon you is no joke. It's a blinking bore!" --The Scarecrow ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 19:55:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: TODAY'S OZ GROWLS RUTH - Sorry for the misunderstanding. I thought you were asking about the Oz Research Group. When I searched the back issues I found you were the source for information on the current operator. That was why I repeated your post. There's a lot of missing going on lately. Tyler sent me the 6th so now I see why the Lau post was wanted. Dave - I wonder how many sets of 4/5 OCT you received. I'll buy a copy of your new book. Regards, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 22:39:54 -0400 (EDT) From: BARRY ESHKOL ADELMAN Subject: Oz somewhere in the subject line Regarding Anko's comments and their relation to monotheism in the Baum universe, Anko makes s many historically dubious comments that I would consider the Adam comment unreliable. Perhaps the books in Oz that do not wither and rot have been pickled. ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 22:41:32 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-08-96 "Jodel" :-) I've been told your actual name before, but I don't remember it... so I'll just stick to Jodel! Provocative remarks? To me? Do you mean in general, or just about computers? If computers are what you mean, I have some friends who are very passionate about computers, including one who actually hung up the phone on me mid-conversation when he heard I was buying a relatively primitive Mac... Compared to that, nothing seems provocative :-) (don't worry, we made up almost instantly) As for "The Wizard of Oz" as a myth: I am referring to a usage of the word /myth/ that was very popular among some of my professors at the theatre department - granted this is not how most other people usually use the word /myth/. Many literary texts - especially dramatic texts - build upon existing texts or folklore. Sometimes this takes the form of an obvious adaptation, but sometimes this is done much more subtley, through a hint, a half-quote, a mere suggestion. In order for this to work, the original text must be one that is so familiar to the audience (or the readers) that it is almost a part of their cultural makeup. I would expect that your own cultural makeup is such that if I were to type: "the better to smell you with my dear", you could not help but think of a certain storybook character, whose name I will not mention, the better to prove my point to you my dear. :-) These stories, texts or concepts which are part of a persons cultural makeup are what my professors sometimes refer to as "myths".I would argue that in this sense of the word, "The Wizard of Oz" has acquired mythological status. However, I would also tend to agree that /myth/ is not neccesarily the best word for this, because of its other, more religious connotations, and perhaps a better term should be coined. (If this still seems odd to you, I think the sense of the word /myth/ that I'm referring to is the same sense as is used in phrases suc